Discussion:
Venezuela kicks U.S. airlines out
(too old to reply)
air-news
2006-02-25 01:06:31 UTC
Permalink
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer

Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.

Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said late
Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States 10
years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has failed
to recognize improvements since then.

"We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical authority,"
the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce the
frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."

The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
television.

In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela. He said the U.S. urged Venezuela to
respect the agreement.

Relations between Caracas and Washington have been tense recently,
with U.S. officials criticizing Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who
has threatened to cut off oil exports to the U.S.

Roberto Pulido, president of the Venezuelan Association of Airlines,
said the three U.S. carriers were told of the ban on Thursday and were
meeting Friday with Venezuelan aviation officials.

"The closing or restriction of operations by these airlines will ...
dramatically affect tourism and business," the association said in a
statement.

Atlanta-based Delta Air Lines operates a daily route from Atlanta to
Venezuela. Continental Airlines has a daily round trip to Caracas from
Houston and a weekly round trip to Caracas from Newark, N.J.

"We are very disappointed by this unilateral action by the Venezuelan
government," said Gina Laughlin, a spokeswoman for Delta.

Continental is negotiating with Venezuelan authorities "to try to
resolve the situation immediately and amicably," the carrier said
Friday.

"The outcome, however, is not within Continental's control," it said.

American Airlines operates up to seven flights a day to Venezuela,
mostly from Miami but also from Dallas-Fort Worth, New York and San
Juan, Puerto Rico. Venezuela is threatening to eliminate all but three
daily flights between Miami and Caracas, American officials said.

American Airlines spokesman Dan Elwell said the airline was surprised
by the announcement.

"American Airlines had no warning of this announcement at all," Elwell
said.

FedEx Corp. spokeswoman Sandra Munoz said the shipping company has
five flights a week to Venezuela and may also be affected by the ban.

The FAA restricted Venezuelan flights to the U.S. in 1996 because it
said the country didn't meet international safety standards.

Venezuelan officials say they have improved standards since then.

AMR shares fell 64 cents, or 2.5 percent, to close at $25.23 on the
New York Stock Exchange, while Continental shares lost 7 cents to
close at $23.24. Delta is operating under bankruptcy court protection.
Buck Fusche
2006-02-25 01:32:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by air-news
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.
Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said late
Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States 10
years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has failed
to recognize improvements since then.
"We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical authority,"
the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce the
frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."
The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
television.
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela.
Now there's a quote for the history books. Hey Adam, you
think trying to overthrow a democratically elected government
doesn't break any agreements?

I guess democracy is fine, as long as you sell oil to America.
Bob's-your-uncle!
2006-02-25 03:40:57 UTC
Permalink
democratically-elected
Post by Buck Fusche
Post by air-news
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.
Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said late
Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States 10
years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has failed
to recognize improvements since then.
"We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical authority,"
the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce the
frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."
The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
television.
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela.
Now there's a quote for the history books. Hey Adam, you
think trying to overthrow a democratically elected government
doesn't break any agreements?
I guess democracy is fine, as long as you sell oil to America.
g***@gmail.com
2006-02-26 19:05:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob's-your-uncle!
democratically-elected
The hyphen is not needed with an adverb.

Cheers,

George W. Russell
Bangalore
Tchiowa
2006-02-25 10:45:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Buck Fusche
Post by air-news
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela.
Now there's a quote for the history books. Hey Adam, you
think trying to overthrow a democratically elected government
doesn't break any agreements?
The US didn't try to overthrow Chavez. His own military did.

Ooops

The US barred Venezuelan air lines from flying to the US because their
safety practices don't meet international standards.
Buck Fusche
2006-02-25 11:36:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tchiowa
Post by Buck Fusche
Post by air-news
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela.
Now there's a quote for the history books. Hey Adam, you
think trying to overthrow a democratically elected government
doesn't break any agreements?
The US didn't try to overthrow Chavez. His own military did.
Oh please. Do we really need to drag out the Don Rumsfeld
quotes again? E.g. "[Chavez] is a person who was elected
legally, just as Adolf Hitler was elected legally..."

Ha ha, good one Donny.

And as for "his own military", just two words: Wayne Madsen:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0,4273,4403366,00.html
Shawn Hirn
2006-02-25 13:41:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Buck Fusche
Post by Tchiowa
Post by Buck Fusche
Post by air-news
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela.
Now there's a quote for the history books. Hey Adam, you
think trying to overthrow a democratically elected government
doesn't break any agreements?
The US didn't try to overthrow Chavez. His own military did.
Oh please. Do we really need to drag out the Don Rumsfeld
quotes again? E.g. "[Chavez] is a person who was elected
legally, just as Adolf Hitler was elected legally..."
Ha ha, good one Donny.
Chavez is no angel, but neither are Bush and Rumsfeld.
Tom Peel
2006-02-25 15:05:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tchiowa
Post by Buck Fusche
Post by air-news
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela.
Now there's a quote for the history books. Hey Adam, you
think trying to overthrow a democratically elected government
doesn't break any agreements?
The US didn't try to overthrow Chavez. His own military did.
with a little help from a Certain Intelligence Agency perhaps?
T.
Post by Tchiowa
Ooops
The US barred Venezuelan air lines from flying to the US because their
safety practices don't meet international standards.
RobH
2006-02-25 04:13:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by air-news
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.
The only thing that keeps Bush from making up some bullshit reason and
attacking Venezuela is Bushs total and complete fuckup in Iraq. If Chavez
gets shot dead, you can bet Bush had it done. I hope Chavez has good
bodyguards.
Docky Wocky
2006-02-25 04:36:26 UTC
Permalink
from air-news:

"By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer

Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said..."
______________________________________
So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out of
Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint that allows
their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved planes for the
USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
Hjalmar Leon
2006-02-25 05:06:28 UTC
Permalink
americans !.....let venezuela solve their own problems.
Post by Docky Wocky
"By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said..."
______________________________________
So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out of
Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint that
allows their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved planes
for the USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
PM
2006-02-25 14:23:29 UTC
Permalink
did you see any american intervention or on venezuelan territory
imposing any measure ?
so what are you talking about here then ?

the mother fucker Chavez is an ennemy of Freedom and Democracy , an
ally of ennemies of the USA>
So fuck them all !

"Hjalmar Leon" <***@sprynet.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
oBRLf.4978$***@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
| americans !.....let venezuela solve their own problems.
|
| "Docky Wocky" <***@lst.net> wrote in message
| news:e9RLf.10317$***@trnddc08...
| >
| >
| > from air-news:
| >
| > "By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
| >
| > Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air
Lines
| > from flying into this South American nation and is restricting
flights
| > by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
| > nation's federal aviation agency said..."
| > ______________________________________
| > So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out
of
| > Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint
that
| > allows their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved
planes
| > for the USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
| >
|
|
Nisse PowerMan
2006-02-27 13:01:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by PM
did you see any american intervention or on venezuelan territory
imposing any measure ?
so what are you talking about here then ?
the mother fucker Chavez is an ennemy of Freedom and Democracy , an
ally of ennemies of the USA>
So fuck them all !
| americans !.....let venezuela solve their own problems.
|
| >
| >
| >
| > "By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
| >
| > Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air
Lines
| > from flying into this South American nation and is restricting
flights
| > by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
| > nation's federal aviation agency said..."
| > ______________________________________
| > So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out
of
| > Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint
that
| > allows their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved
planes
| > for the USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
| >
|
|
Still he was elected!
It was a free and fair election.
No ballots were confiscated by his brother.
He even won the election.

It's as good as democracy can be in this world, many nations do not
accept the winner to be elected. Still they call themselves democracies,
but ofcourse that is just plain bullshit.

Anyways, have a wonderful day out there,

Nisse
--
Remove the obvious part before replying by mail please!
krp
2006-02-27 14:47:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nisse PowerMan
|
Still he was elected!
It was a free and fair election.
No ballots were confiscated by his brother.
He even won the election.
It's as good as democracy can be in this world, many nations do not
accept the winner to be elected.
Isn't it just great to be able to say; "I was democratically elected we need
have NO further elections I am PRESIDENTE POR LA VIDA!!!!
Shawn Hirn
2006-02-25 13:38:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Docky Wocky
"By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said..."
______________________________________
So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out of
Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint that allows
their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved planes for the
USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
How do we know the Venezuelan airlines are unsafe? Considering how wrong
the American government has been on many issues over the past few years,
they do not exactly have a lot of credibility.
krp
2006-02-26 01:29:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Shawn Hirn
Post by Docky Wocky
"By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said..."
______________________________________
So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out of
Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint that allows
their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved planes for the
USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
How do we know the Venezuelan airlines are unsafe? Considering how wrong
the American government has been on many issues over the past few years,
they do not exactly have a lot of credibility.
Because the INSPECTIONS is not done by the C IA buffoon, it's done by the
International Aviation Authority.
SHb
2006-02-28 02:46:10 UTC
Permalink
""" Considering how wrong the American government has been on many issues
over the past few years,
they do not exactly have a lot of credibility."""""

The hate America crowd is among us. Oh gosh!
Go cash your welfare check and get bent goober.
Post by krp
Post by Shawn Hirn
Post by Docky Wocky
"By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said..."
______________________________________
So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out of
Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint that allows
their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved planes for the
USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
How do we know the Venezuelan airlines are unsafe? Considering how wrong
the American government has been on many issues over the past few years,
they do not exactly have a lot of credibility.
Because the INSPECTIONS is not done by the C IA buffoon, it's done by the
International Aviation Authority.
krp
2006-02-28 10:40:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by SHb
""" Considering how wrong the American government has been on many issues
over the past few years,
they do not exactly have a lot of credibility."""""
The hate America crowd is among us. Oh gosh!
Go cash your welfare check and get bent goober.
He can't face it that the Venezuelan airlines that repeatedly failed
MINIMUM standards wre inspected by INTERNATIONAL AIR SAFETY folks and NOT
GEOEGE W. BUSH or HALIBURTON on a NO BID CONTRACT!
Post by SHb
Post by krp
Post by Shawn Hirn
Post by Docky Wocky
"By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said..."
______________________________________
So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out of
Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint that allows
their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved planes for the
USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
How do we know the Venezuelan airlines are unsafe? Considering how wrong
the American government has been on many issues over the past few years,
they do not exactly have a lot of credibility.
Because the INSPECTIONS is not done by the C IA buffoon, it's done by the
International Aviation Authority.
PM
2006-02-25 14:21:50 UTC
Permalink
JE, JE, the USA SHOULD PROHIBIT THE FLIGHTS OF ANY vENEZUELAN
AIRLINES TO THE usa OR OVER ITS TERRITORY...
IDEM FOR CUBAN AIRLINES WHICH ARE ON THE SAME BAG WITH CHAVEZ



"Docky Wocky" <***@lst.net> a écrit dans le message de news:
e9RLf.10317$***@trnddc08...
|
|
| from air-news:
|
| "By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
|
| Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
| from flying into this South American nation and is restricting
flights
| by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
| nation's federal aviation agency said..."
| ______________________________________
| So, comes March 1, 2006, any brave Venezuelan who wants to get out
of
| Chvez's paradise and into the USA has to fly to some other joint
that allows
| their unsafe aircraft to flop in, then change to approved planes for
the
| USA. I would say that is a win-win situation for the US.
|
|
krp
2006-02-25 10:24:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by air-news
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.
Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said late
Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States 10
years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has failed
to recognize improvements since then.
"We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical authority,"
the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce the
frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."
The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
television.
And I think that ALL air traffic of ALL kinds between the US and Venezuela
should be blocked!
Shawn Hirn
2006-02-25 13:36:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
And I think that ALL air traffic of ALL kinds between the US and Venezuela
should be blocked!
Why?
krp
2006-02-26 01:28:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
And I think that ALL air traffic of ALL kinds between the US and Venezuela
should be blocked!
Why?
Hmmm Chavez wants to kick ALL U.S. airlines out of flying to Venezuela
because the U.S. blocked (temporarily) two of the Venezuelan airlines
because of SERIOUS safety violations that were not and HAVE NOT been
sufficiently brought up to international safety standards. Have they
improved? Sure - a little but not enough.
Those airlines continue to fail safety inspections by INTERNATIONAL aviation
authorities. It ain't exactly as if Venezuela can't afford to upgrade their
planes and maintenance.
Miguel
2006-02-26 05:01:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
Post by krp
And I think that ALL air traffic of ALL kinds between the US and Venezuela
should be blocked!
Why?
Hmmm Chavez wants to kick ALL U.S. airlines out of flying to Venezuela
because the U.S. blocked (temporarily) two of the Venezuelan airlines
because of SERIOUS safety violations that were not and HAVE NOT been
sufficiently brought up to international safety standards. Have they
improved? Sure - a little but not enough.
Those airlines continue to fail safety inspections by INTERNATIONAL aviation
authorities. It ain't exactly as if Venezuela can't afford to upgrade their
planes and maintenance.
Chavez is trying to create an International crisis. He nneds it to
raise his prestige with the anti US forces around the world. It is a
matter of time. We better be ready. It's coming!
krp
2006-02-26 13:34:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Miguel
Post by krp
Post by krp
And I think that ALL air traffic of ALL kinds between the US and Venezuela
should be blocked!
Why?
Hmmm Chavez wants to kick ALL U.S. airlines out of flying to Venezuela
because the U.S. blocked (temporarily) two of the Venezuelan airlines
because of SERIOUS safety violations that were not and HAVE NOT been
sufficiently brought up to international safety standards. Have they
improved? Sure - a little but not enough.
Those airlines continue to fail safety inspections by INTERNATIONAL aviation
authorities. It ain't exactly as if Venezuela can't afford to upgrade their
planes and maintenance.
Chavez is trying to create an International crisis. He nneds it to
raise his prestige with the anti US forces around the world. It is a
matter of time. We better be ready. It's coming!
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis after
another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. mobilize the people to repel an
imaginary invasion. Blare the air raid sirens at 2 AM... Create as much
panic and hysteria in the people as possible that the lions are at the gates
of the city! The SKY is falling. And then play Latin MACHISMO!

Christ this script is BORING as hell.. The MOON is over PARADOR!
James Robinson
2006-02-26 15:01:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. mobilize the people to
repel an imaginary invasion. Blare the air raid sirens at 2 AM...
Create as much panic and hysteria in the people as possible that the
lions are at the gates of the city! The SKY is falling. And then play
Latin MACHISMO!
Christ this script is BORING as hell.. The MOON is over PARADOR!
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of terrorist
attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out of office.
krp
2006-02-26 23:32:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. mobilize the people to
repel an imaginary invasion. Blare the air raid sirens at 2 AM...
Create as much panic and hysteria in the people as possible that the
lions are at the gates of the city! The SKY is falling. And then play
Latin MACHISMO!
Christ this script is BORING as hell.. The MOON is over PARADOR!
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of terrorist
attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong but I
don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela. IT is simply
tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten the people with. In
one case the threat is real and the other its.... well -- - it's
BULLSHIT!!


Got it?
James Robinson
2006-02-27 01:27:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of terrorist
attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong but
I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela. IT is
simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten the
people with. In one case the threat is real and the other its....
well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more recent
political meddling in various Central and South American countries are
considered as proof that the US is ready to continue that sort of activity
in the future. (remember the overthrow of Allende, the invasion of the
Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua,
the US backed overthrow of governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil,
Haiti, etc. etc.?)

To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the past
actions of the US government.
m***@msn.com
2006-02-27 06:42:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of terrorist
attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong but
I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela. IT is
simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten the
people with. In one case the threat is real and the other its....
well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more recent
political meddling in various Central and South American countries are
considered as proof that the US is ready to continue that sort of activity
in the future. (remember the overthrow of Allende, the invasion of the
Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua,
the US backed overthrow of governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil,
Haiti, etc. etc.?)
I guess that according to your leyends, the old USSR and his bearded
puppet in Latin America never interfered in the internal affairs of
Latin and African countries. Everynight, instead of reading the Bible
before going to bed, these good Communists would fall asleep reading
the Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital, after saying a prayer to Lenin.
How nice they are!
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the past
actions of the US government.
a***@yahoo.com
2006-02-27 06:59:51 UTC
Permalink
Same shit same fanatics.
James Robinson
2006-02-27 09:00:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of
terrorist attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out
of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong
but I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela.
IT is simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten
the people with. In one case the threat is real and the other
its.... well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more
recent political meddling in various Central and South American
countries are considered as proof that the US is ready to continue
that sort of activity in the future. (remember the overthrow of
Allende, the invasion of the Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of
Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua, the US backed overthrow of
governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil, Haiti, etc. etc.?)
I guess that according to your leyends, the old USSR and his bearded
puppet in Latin America never interfered in the internal affairs of
Latin and African countries. Everynight, instead of reading the Bible
before going to bed, these good Communists would fall asleep reading
the Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital, after saying a prayer to
Lenin. How nice they are!
Not sure what that has to do with how the Venezuelans view the US as a
potential threat, which Chavez uses to his advantage.
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the
past actions of the US government.
Avidbuff
2006-02-27 12:52:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Robinson
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of
terrorist attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out
of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong
but I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela.
IT is simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten
the people with. In one case the threat is real and the other
its.... well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more
recent political meddling in various Central and South American
countries are considered as proof that the US is ready to continue
that sort of activity in the future. (remember the overthrow of
Allende, the invasion of the Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of
Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua, the US backed overthrow of
governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil, Haiti, etc. etc.?)
I guess that according to your leyends, the old USSR and his bearded
puppet in Latin America never interfered in the internal affairs of
Latin and African countries. Everynight, instead of reading the Bible
before going to bed, these good Communists would fall asleep reading
the Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital, after saying a prayer to
Lenin. How nice they are!
Not sure what that has to do with how the Venezuelans view the US as a
potential threat, which Chavez uses to his advantage.
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the
past actions of the US government.
He couldn't refute your statement so he attacked you.

*** Free account sponsored by SecureIX.com ***
*** Encrypt your Internet usage with a free VPN account from http://www.SecureIX.com ***
krp
2006-02-27 14:53:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Avidbuff
Post by James Robinson
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of
terrorist attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out
of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong
but I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela.
IT is simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten
the people with. In one case the threat is real and the other
its.... well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more
recent political meddling in various Central and South American
countries are considered as proof that the US is ready to continue
that sort of activity in the future. (remember the overthrow of
Allende, the invasion of the Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of
Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua, the US backed overthrow of
governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil, Haiti, etc. etc.?)
I guess that according to your leyends, the old USSR and his bearded
puppet in Latin America never interfered in the internal affairs of
Latin and African countries. Everynight, instead of reading the Bible
before going to bed, these good Communists would fall asleep reading
the Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital, after saying a prayer to
Lenin. How nice they are!
Not sure what that has to do with how the Venezuelans view the US as a
potential threat, which Chavez uses to his advantage.
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the
past actions of the US government.
He couldn't refute your statement so he attacked you.
Do you want me to accept that that asshole speaks for the people of
Venezuela?" HUH dimwit? How many IDIOTS do you think there are in Venezuela
who REALLY think an invasion by the U.S. is likely? Add to that how many
would WELCOME IT now that they are living the GOOD LIFE under El Presidente
por la vida? How many times has the U.,S. invaded Venezuela <jeopardy theme
plays> HOW MANY? 20? 50? 200? 2,000? 2 MILLION? I know - EXACTLY NEVER!!!
Avidbuff
2006-02-27 15:46:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by James Robinson
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one
crisis after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of
terrorist attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats
out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be
wrong but I don't believe the United States has ever invaded
Venezuela. IT is simply tired old propaganda to invent a
boogeyman to frighten the people with. In one case the threat is
real and the other its.... well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more
recent political meddling in various Central and South American
countries are considered as proof that the US is ready to continue
that sort of activity in the future. (remember the overthrow of
Allende, the invasion of the Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay
of Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua, the US backed overthrow of
governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil, Haiti, etc. etc.?)
I guess that according to your leyends, the old USSR and his
bearded puppet in Latin America never interfered in the internal
affairs of Latin and African countries. Everynight, instead of
reading the Bible before going to bed, these good Communists would
fall asleep reading the Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital, after
saying a prayer to Lenin. How nice they are!
Not sure what that has to do with how the Venezuelans view the US as
a potential threat, which Chavez uses to his advantage.
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the
past actions of the US government.
He couldn't refute your statement so he attacked you.
Do you want me to accept that that asshole speaks for the people of
Venezuela?" HUH dimwit?
Moreso than any of the previous governments drawn from the ruling spanish
(decendant) elite.

How many IDIOTS do you think there are in
Post by krp
Venezuela who REALLY think an invasion by the U.S. is likely?
probably very few... but ignorance can breed fear and if someone keeps
screaming that the people are in danger some will become convinced. Now
where did that happen? I seem to recall...

Add to
Post by krp
that how many would WELCOME IT now that they are living the GOOD LIFE
under El Presidente por la vida?
Well the native peoples definitely welcome it...Education ...health care.
The previous elite (the minority of spanish colonial decent who
previously ruled) no doubt despise him. ass of course do the oil
companies who loath the idea of giving up some of the profits on their
oil!

How many times has the U.,S. invaded
Post by krp
Venezuela <jeopardy theme plays> HOW MANY? 20? 50? 200? 2,000? 2
MILLION? I know - EXACTLY NEVER!!!
Nor will they... at least not until oil really becomes an issue. But they
have and will fund his opposition. Its SOP for pretty much every world
power to interfere whereever/whenever they feel their national interests
are threatened. Pick a world power and goggle them, you'll see their
fingers in many pies.

That Chavez is a nut job, I'll grant you. But we are all very familiar
with nut jobs making their way to positions of power and his arguments
while exaggerated are not completely without merit. Bush exaggerated the
threat of Saddam but he wasn't wrong (at least in my opinion) about
Saddam's intentions to seek WMD.

As far as becoming a Dictatorship or a Communist style gov the jury is
out. At the moment he is democratically elected. Until his mandate is
exhausted or he takes steps to perpetuate his rule we will have to wait
and see.
*** Free account sponsored by SecureIX.com ***
*** Encrypt your Internet usage with a free VPN account from http://www.SecureIX.com ***
krp
2006-02-27 23:17:35 UTC
Permalink
"Avidbuff" <***@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:***@66.150.105.47...

INSTANT REPLY FROM OLE....
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by James Robinson
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one
crisis after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of
terrorist attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats
out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be
wrong but I don't believe the United States has ever invaded
Venezuela. IT is simply tired old propaganda to invent a
boogeyman to frighten the people with. In one case the threat is
real and the other its.... well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more
recent political meddling in various Central and South American
countries are considered as proof that the US is ready to continue
that sort of activity in the future. (remember the overthrow of
Allende, the invasion of the Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay
of Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua, the US backed overthrow of
governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil, Haiti, etc. etc.?)
I guess that according to your leyends, the old USSR and his
bearded puppet in Latin America never interfered in the internal
affairs of Latin and African countries. Everynight, instead of
reading the Bible before going to bed, these good Communists would
fall asleep reading the Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital, after
saying a prayer to Lenin. How nice they are!
Not sure what that has to do with how the Venezuelans view the US as
a potential threat, which Chavez uses to his advantage.
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the
past actions of the US government.
He couldn't refute your statement so he attacked you.
Do you want me to accept that that asshole speaks for the people of
Venezuela?" HUH dimwit?
Moreso than any of the previous governments drawn from the ruling spanish
(decendant) elite.
Give me a break. That crap broke down decades ago.
Post by Avidbuff
How many IDIOTS do you think there are in
Post by krp
Venezuela who REALLY think an invasion by the U.S. is likely?
probably very few... but ignorance can breed fear and if someone keeps
screaming that the people are in danger some will become convinced. Now
where did that happen? I seem to recall...
Not even HIGO CHAVEZ believes the U.S. will invade. It is only a
propaganda tool. Like the magician making broad gestures with his left hand
so you won't notice what he is doing with his right hand. Only the VERY
uneducated are fooled.
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Add to that how many would WELCOME IT now that they are living the GOOD
LIFE
under El Presidente por la vida? (The invasion)
Well the native peoples definitely welcome it...Education ...health care.
The previous elite (the minority of spanish colonial decent who
previously ruled) no doubt despise him. ass of course do the oil
companies who loath the idea of giving up some of the profits on their
oil!
Really you think the native peoples would welcome an American invasion?
Interesting. You know I listen to this "Motorcyle Diaries" type of amusing
sophomoric rhetoric and just sit and chuckle. To hear Che Guevara rant and
rave about the Spanish Elite.. Was amusing because that was HIM to a T and
he behaved just like one. But I digress. I just find bullshit so amusing at
times. And you want me to believe this?
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
How many times has the U.,S. invaded Venezuela <jeopardy theme plays>
HOW MANY? 20? 50? 200? 2,000? 2
MILLION? I know - EXACTLY NEVER!!!
Nor will they... at least not until oil really becomes an issue. But they
have and will fund his opposition. Its SOP for pretty much every world
power to interfere whereever/whenever they feel their national interests
are threatened. Pick a world power and goggle them, you'll see their
fingers in many pies.
This is really tiresome REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY tiresome. It has
been SO overused. It was used about Afghanistan. Small problem the ONLY oil
in AFghanistan is in the crankcases of vehicles. Otherwise NOT A DROP! It
is said about Iraq - however not a drop of Iraqi oil goes to the U.S. and
American companies don't operate it. The oil goes to France, Germany, Japan
and CHINA! NOT America. The U.S. IS - - however the major customer for oil
from Venezuela. However if the little shit gets nasty we could just as well
buy our oil from Russia we get from the petty little EL PRESIDENTE POR LA
VIDA! I think those people in Venezuela making noises might go a little
hungry. Yes, they could find a replacement customer at 45% of the price they
are getting from the U.S. AND............ The U.S could SIEZE all of CITGO's
assetts in the U.S....
Post by Avidbuff
That Chavez is a nut job, I'll grant you. But we are all very familiar
with nut jobs making their way to positions of power and his arguments
while exaggerated are not completely without merit. Bush exaggerated the
threat of Saddam but he wasn't wrong (at least in my opinion) about
Saddam's intentions to seek WMD.
His arguments are pure BULLSHIT as are many of yours.
Post by Avidbuff
As far as becoming a Dictatorship or a Communist style gov the jury is
out. At the moment he is democratically elected. Until his mandate is
exhausted or he takes steps to perpetuate his rule we will have to wait
and see.
The FACT is the SIMPLE fact - other than VERY BRIEF periods under Marti
and Bolivar Latin America has NEVER known democracy. The people of Latin
America have been getting it up the ass for the past 8000 years or so. They
rotate between one whacky kind of dictator to another.. Right win to left
wing, religious NUTS and so on..
Avidbuff
2006-02-28 01:28:39 UTC
Permalink
"Give me a break. That crap broke down decades ago."

80% of Venezuela is own by 5% of the people and it is from this pool
(almost exclusively of spanish descent) that most gov offices were
filled. It's not "broke down" just yet. Of course all countries show
show a similar proclivity for a ruling elite, but many Venezuelans
don't own the land they've lived on for generations.


"Really you think the native peoples would welcome an American
invasion? "

No actually I do not. I believe that those who were formally in power
would welcome it (invasion). As would of course the oil companies.
Sorry about the confusion.

"This is really tiresome REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY tiresome. It has
been SO overused."

I agree completely. I was not speaking of Afghanistan.. an action I am
completely on board with. My point was simply that Governments protect
their national interests. Period.
krp
2006-02-28 10:40:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Avidbuff
"Give me a break. That crap broke down decades ago."
80% of Venezuela is own by 5% of the people and it is from this pool
(almost exclusively of spanish descent) that most gov offices were
filled. It's not "broke down" just yet. Of course all countries show
show a similar proclivity for a ruling elite, but many Venezuelans
don't own the land they've lived on for generations.
Your racist notions are noted. So anyone with any Spanish heritage are
not Venezuelans. I GOT IT! Or Columbians, etc. GOIT IT! SIEG HEIL MEIN
FUEHRER!
(Heels click arm upraised in the proper salute!) Gee and in America we have
the RULING ELITE anglos... BAAAAAAADDDD!!!
Post by Avidbuff
"Really you think the native peoples would welcome an American invasion?
"
No actually I do not. I believe that those who were formally in power
would welcome it (invasion). As would of course the oil companies.
Sorry about the confusion.
Guy want to throw history around about the NOBLE NOBLE NOBLE native
peoples? the PEACE LOVING natives and their histories? Want to look at the
history of the American continents from about 8,000 years ago to more recent
histories? The great pyramids of the Americas where on some of them there
would be daily blood orgies of the "sacrifices" of the slaves they captured
in their constant wars sometimes 10,000 people in a single day. So now that
we can shove some bullshit aside, maybe we can look at history with a little
less brown in your eyes. I am NOT going to defend the Spanish. Or get into
the reasons why they were so bloodthirsty following expelling the Moors.
Let's leave history, all your racist shit where they bel,ong - in history
and deal with TODAY.
Post by Avidbuff
"This is really tiresome REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY tiresome. It has been
SO overused."
I agree completely. I was not speaking of Afghanistan.. an action I am
completely on board with. My point was simply that Governments protect
their national interests. Period.
The interests of their people as they have the vision to see it. And
that may mean sleeping with a dictator because that is your only choice. I
think there have been precious FEW governments in Latin America that the
U.S. has been completely happy with. Probably at the time of Marti and
perhaps Simon Bolivar, not much else. You deal with what's dealt. Be nice to
always hold 4 aces wouldn't it? OR the U.S. could go in and just take over
ALL of the Americas and install democratic institutions. AS IF WE ARE INSANE
ENOUGH to believe that is even possible. You CANNOT force people to become
REAL democrats..... I suggest that the people of Latin America neither
understand nor appreciate REAL democracy. If they did there would not be
even ONE of the present governments standing except right now Bolivia's new
government that has not had time to show its true colors yet.
Avidbuff
2006-02-28 13:17:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
"Give me a break. That crap broke down decades ago."
80% of Venezuela is own by 5% of the people and it is from this pool
(almost exclusively of spanish descent) that most gov offices were
filled. It's not "broke down" just yet. Of course all countries show
show a similar proclivity for a ruling elite, but many Venezuelans
don't own the land they've lived on for generations.
Your racist notions are noted. So anyone with any Spanish heritage are
not Venezuelans. I GOT IT! Or Columbians, etc. GOIT IT! SIEG HEIL
MEIN FUEHRER!
(Heels click arm upraised in the proper salute!) Gee and in America
we have the RULING ELITE anglos... BAAAAAAADDDD!!!
non sequitur.
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by Avidbuff
"Really you think the native peoples would welcome an American
invasion? "
No actually I do not. I believe that those who were formally in power
would welcome it (invasion). As would of course the oil companies.
Sorry about the confusion.
Guy want to throw history around about the NOBLE NOBLE NOBLE native
peoples? the PEACE LOVING natives and their histories? Want to look at
the history of the American continents from about 8,000 years ago to
more recent histories? The great pyramids of the Americas where on
some of them there would be daily blood orgies of the "sacrifices" of
the slaves they captured in their constant wars sometimes 10,000
people in a single day. So now that we can shove some bullshit aside,
maybe we can look at history with a little less brown in your eyes. I
am NOT going to defend the Spanish. Or get into the reasons why they
were so bloodthirsty following expelling the Moors. Let's leave
history, all your racist shit where they bel,ong - in history and deal
with TODAY.
Are you off your meds? You start with a cogent argument and then slide
into a distribe that has nothing to do with what is being discussed.
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
"This is really tiresome REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY tiresome. It has
been SO overused."
I agree completely. I was not speaking of Afghanistan.. an action I
am completely on board with. My point was simply that Governments
protect their national interests. Period.
The interests of their people as they have the vision to see it.
Yes...but often this "vision" has been skewed by ignorance as well as
greed and corruption. I'm not singling out a specific country here ...
there are numerous examples of personal ambition determining national
policy.
Post by krp
And
that may mean sleeping with a dictator because that is your only
choice. I think there have been precious FEW governments in Latin
America that the U.S. has been completely happy with. Probably at the
time of Marti and perhaps Simon Bolivar, not much else. You deal with
what's dealt. Be nice to always hold 4 aces wouldn't it? OR the U.S.
could go in and just take over ALL of the Americas and install
democratic institutions. AS IF WE ARE INSANE ENOUGH to believe that is
even possible. You CANNOT force people to become REAL democrats..... I
suggest that the people of Latin America neither understand nor
appreciate REAL democracy. If they did there would not be even ONE of
the present governments standing except right now Bolivia's new
government that has not had time to show its true colors yet.
Irrelevant to my point. Of course you deal with the cards you have.

*** Free account sponsored by SecureIX.com ***
*** Encrypt your Internet usage with a free VPN account from http://www.SecureIX.com ***
krp
2006-02-28 17:39:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by Avidbuff
"Really you think the native peoples would welcome an American
invasion? "
No actually I do not. I believe that those who were formally in power
would welcome it (invasion). As would of course the oil companies.
Sorry about the confusion.
Guy want to throw history around about the NOBLE NOBLE NOBLE native
peoples? the PEACE LOVING natives and their histories? Want to look at
the history of the American continents from about 8,000 years ago to
more recent histories? The great pyramids of the Americas where on
some of them there would be daily blood orgies of the "sacrifices" of
the slaves they captured in their constant wars sometimes 10,000
people in a single day. So now that we can shove some bullshit aside,
maybe we can look at history with a little less brown in your eyes. I
am NOT going to defend the Spanish. Or get into the reasons why they
were so bloodthirsty following expelling the Moors. Let's leave
history, all your racist shit where they bel,ong - in history and deal
with TODAY.
Are you off your meds? You start with a cogent argument and then slide
into a distribe that has nothing to do with what is being discussed.
Maybe I am just sick as shit for the U.S. being constantly blamed for
everything that is going wrong and had gone wrong in Latin America. The
cogent part of the statement is the democracy is a joke in Latin America.
Take the typical L:A nation and it is counted in RPM.. Revolutions per
minute! Right wing - left wing the butchery continues.
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
"This is really tiresome REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY tiresome. It has
been SO overused."
I agree completely. I was not speaking of Afghanistan.. an action I
am completely on board with. My point was simply that Governments
protect their national interests. Period.
The interests of their people as they have the vision to see it.
Yes...but often this "vision" has been skewed by ignorance as well as
greed and corruption. I'm not singling out a specific country here ...
there are numerous examples of personal ambition determining national
policy.
That ignorance is deliberate and has been for thousands of years. They
don't know and they don't WANT to know! Remember - I have been to Cuba, I
have seen the great educational outreach up close and personal. And there
are STILL people who refuse to look at a book much less open it. Their
ignorance is deliberate.
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
And
that may mean sleeping with a dictator because that is your only
choice. I think there have been precious FEW governments in Latin
America that the U.S. has been completely happy with. Probably at the
time of Marti and perhaps Simon Bolivar, not much else. You deal with
what's dealt. Be nice to always hold 4 aces wouldn't it? OR the U.S.
could go in and just take over ALL of the Americas and install
democratic institutions. AS IF WE ARE INSANE ENOUGH to believe that is
even possible. You CANNOT force people to become REAL democrats..... I
suggest that the people of Latin America neither understand nor
appreciate REAL democracy. If they did there would not be even ONE of
the present governments standing except right now Bolivia's new
government that has not had time to show its true colors yet.
Irrelevant to my point. Of course you deal with the cards you have.
But it is central to my point. As screwed up as American policies may
have been and are likely to continue to be - Latin Americans have nobody to
blame but themselves.
Avidbuff
2006-03-01 13:39:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by Avidbuff
"Really you think the native peoples would welcome an American
invasion? "
No actually I do not. I believe that those who were formally in
power would welcome it (invasion). As would of course the oil
companies. Sorry about the confusion.
Guy want to throw history around about the NOBLE NOBLE NOBLE native
peoples? the PEACE LOVING natives and their histories? Want to look
at the history of the American continents from about 8,000 years ago
to more recent histories? The great pyramids of the Americas where
on some of them there would be daily blood orgies of the
"sacrifices" of the slaves they captured in their constant wars
sometimes 10,000 people in a single day. So now that we can shove
some bullshit aside, maybe we can look at history with a little less
brown in your eyes. I am NOT going to defend the Spanish. Or get
into the reasons why they were so bloodthirsty following expelling
the Moors. Let's leave history, all your racist shit where they
bel,ong - in history and deal with TODAY.
Are you off your meds? You start with a cogent argument and then
slide into a distribe that has nothing to do with what is being
discussed.
Maybe I am just sick as shit for the U.S. being constantly blamed for
everything that is going wrong and had gone wrong in Latin America.
The cogent part of the statement is the democracy is a joke in Latin
America. Take the typical L:A nation and it is counted in RPM..
Revolutions per minute! Right wing - left wing the butchery
continues.
Well I'd have to agree with you on that one.
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
"This is really tiresome REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY tiresome. It
has been SO overused."
I agree completely. I was not speaking of Afghanistan.. an action I
am completely on board with. My point was simply that Governments
protect their national interests. Period.
The interests of their people as they have the vision to see it.
Yes...but often this "vision" has been skewed by ignorance as well as
greed and corruption. I'm not singling out a specific country here
... there are numerous examples of personal ambition determining
national policy.
That ignorance is deliberate and has been for thousands of years. They
don't know and they don't WANT to know! Remember - I have been to
Cuba, I have seen the great educational outreach up close and
personal. And there are STILL people who refuse to look at a book much
less open it. Their ignorance is deliberate.
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
And
that may mean sleeping with a dictator because that is your only
choice. I think there have been precious FEW governments in Latin
America that the U.S. has been completely happy with. Probably at
the time of Marti and perhaps Simon Bolivar, not much else. You deal
with what's dealt. Be nice to always hold 4 aces wouldn't it? OR the
U.S. could go in and just take over ALL of the Americas and install
democratic institutions. AS IF WE ARE INSANE ENOUGH to believe that
is even possible. You CANNOT force people to become REAL
democrats..... I suggest that the people of Latin America neither
understand nor appreciate REAL democracy. If they did there would
not be even ONE of the present governments standing except right now
Bolivia's new government that has not had time to show its true
colors yet.
Irrelevant to my point. Of course you deal with the cards you have.
But it is central to my point. As screwed up as American policies may
have been and are likely to continue to be - Latin Americans have
nobody to blame but themselves.
Unfortunately passivity is endemic amongst most populations. Democracy is
a privilage that needs to be earned. It demands vigilance, sacrifice and
hard work something few seem to understand. But that being said I also
believe that responibility and authority go hand in hand so I cannot
accept the "nobody to blame but themselves" argument, especially when as
Mao said "political power comes from the barrel of a gun". I cannot
condemn the weak for being weak.

...crap...now I'm off on a tangent.

*** Free account sponsored by SecureIX.com ***
*** Encrypt your Internet usage with a free VPN account from http://www.SecureIX.com ***
Frank F. Matthews
2006-03-01 17:01:54 UTC
Permalink
Avidbuff wrote:

snip
Post by Avidbuff
Unfortunately passivity is endemic amongst most populations. Democracy is
a privilage that needs to be earned. It demands vigilance, sacrifice and
hard work something few seem to understand. But that being said I also
believe that responibility and authority go hand in hand so I cannot
accept the "nobody to blame but themselves" argument, especially when as
Mao said "political power comes from the barrel of a gun". I cannot
condemn the weak for being weak.
snip

That is pretty much how the US got into it's current mess.
krp
2006-03-01 19:50:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by Avidbuff
"Really you think the native peoples would welcome an American
invasion? "
No actually I do not. I believe that those who were formally in
power would welcome it (invasion). As would of course the oil
companies. Sorry about the confusion.
Guy want to throw history around about the NOBLE NOBLE NOBLE native
peoples? the PEACE LOVING natives and their histories? Want to look
at the history of the American continents from about 8,000 years ago
to more recent histories? The great pyramids of the Americas where
on some of them there would be daily blood orgies of the
"sacrifices" of the slaves they captured in their constant wars
sometimes 10,000 people in a single day. So now that we can shove
some bullshit aside, maybe we can look at history with a little less
brown in your eyes. I am NOT going to defend the Spanish. Or get
into the reasons why they were so bloodthirsty following expelling
the Moors. Let's leave history, all your racist shit where they
bel,ong - in history and deal with TODAY.
Are you off your meds? You start with a cogent argument and then
slide into a distribe that has nothing to do with what is being
discussed.
Maybe I am just sick as shit for the U.S. being constantly blamed for
everything that is going wrong and had gone wrong in Latin America.
The cogent part of the statement is the democracy is a joke in Latin
America. Take the typical LA nation and it is counted in RPM..
Revolutions per minute! Right wing - left wing the butchery
continues.
Well I'd have to agree with you on that one.
See it is possible to have a rational discussion.
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
Post by Avidbuff
"This is really tiresome REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY tiresome. It
has been SO overused."
I agree completely. I was not speaking of Afghanistan.. an action I
am completely on board with. My point was simply that Governments
protect their national interests. Period.
The interests of their people as they have the vision to see it.
Yes...but often this "vision" has been skewed by ignorance as well as
greed and corruption. I'm not singling out a specific country here
... there are numerous examples of personal ambition determining
national policy.
That ignorance is deliberate and has been for thousands of years. They
don't know and they don't WANT to know! Remember - I have been to
Cuba, I have seen the great educational outreach up close and
personal. And there are STILL people who refuse to look at a book much
less open it. Their ignorance is deliberate.
Post by Avidbuff
Post by krp
And that may mean sleeping with a dictator because that is your
only
choice. I think there have been precious FEW governments in Latin
America that the U.S. has been completely happy with. Probably at
the time of Marti and perhaps Simon Bolivar, not much else. You deal
with what's dealt. Be nice to always hold 4 aces wouldn't it? OR the
U.S. could go in and just take over ALL of the Americas and install
democratic institutions. AS IF WE ARE INSANE ENOUGH to believe that
is even possible. You CANNOT force people to become REAL
democrats..... I suggest that the people of Latin America neither
understand nor appreciate REAL democracy. If they did there would
not be even ONE of the present governments standing except right now
Bolivia's new government that has not had time to show its true
colors yet.
Irrelevant to my point. Of course you deal with the cards you have.
But it is central to my point. As screwed up as American policies may
have been and are likely to continue to be - Latin Americans have
nobody to blame but themselves.
Unfortunately passivity is endemic amongst most populations. Democracy is
a privilage that needs to be earned. It demands vigilance, sacrifice and
hard work something few seem to understand. But that being said I also
believe that responibility and authority go hand in hand so I cannot
accept the "nobody to blame but themselves" argument, especially when as
Mao said "political power comes from the barrel of a gun". I cannot
condemn the weak for being weak.
It isn't so much passivity as it is lazy people falling victim to the
promises of a free lunch! Which is why the SAME PEOPLE will follow a right
wing moster one week because he promises them freedom and the good life,
riches, and then follow a left wing monster the next week because he
promises the same shit. Latin Americans do not yet understand that "FREEDOM
IS NEVER FREE!" Oh yes guy - people get only the government they deserve.
That is true in all of Latin America, it is true in Cuba, and it is true in
the United States.If you look hard enough you will see that the political
power that comes from a gun barrel is illusory and transient. If you want to
get the most profound image that can be imagined, at least the most powerful
I have seen in MY lifetime - harken back to Tienemen Square and the young
man in the white shirt standing in the path of the tank. The tank swerves to
the left and he moved back in its path - the tank swerves to the right and
again me moves in front of it. ONE SMALL MAN! And a message so profound even
the most hard line in the Communist inner circles caught the message. If ONE
MAN can do that - think of hundreds. Think of thousands. Think of
MILLIONS..........
Post by Avidbuff
...crap...now I'm off on a tangent.
But it is a GOOD productive tangent guy for a change! We are finally TALKING
intelligent!
krp
2006-02-27 11:15:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@msn.com
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of terrorist
attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong but
I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela. IT is
simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten the
people with. In one case the threat is real and the other its....
well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more recent
political meddling in various Central and South American countries are
considered as proof that the US is ready to continue that sort of activity
in the future. (remember the overthrow of Allende, the invasion of the
Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua,
the US backed overthrow of governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil,
Haiti, etc. etc.?)
I guess that according to your leyends, the old USSR and his bearded
puppet in Latin America never interfered in the internal affairs of
Latin and African countries. Everynight, instead of reading the Bible
before going to bed, these good Communists would fall asleep reading
the Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital, after saying a prayer to Lenin.
How nice they are!
No they were helping the "RIGHT" side! The PEOPLE.................... The
PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC . . no wait.. THE DEMOCRATIC PEOPLE'S REPUBLIC!

This kind of DIMWIT has NO concept of the "people." They just adore BIG
BROTHER! They will get on their knees and felate a left wing dictator on the
promise that SOMEDAY there will be a slab of meat on the table. You see the
USSR dumping tons of land mines, AK-47's, RPG's into the hands of the
Sandinistas was a NOBLE AND HUMANITARIAN thing to do. Allowing THEM to
forcibly overthrow the ELECTED government was a GOOD thing because it wasn't
the RIGHT KIND of government. And the PEOPLE rising up (CONTRAS) and
fighting to take back THEIR country is BAD - it's EVIL because there can be
ONLY ONE WAY! MY WAY... SOCIALISMO O MUERTE!
Don Klipstein
2006-02-27 20:00:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
You see the
USSR dumping tons of land mines, AK-47's, RPG's into the hands of the
Sandinistas was a NOBLE AND HUMANITARIAN thing to do. Allowing THEM to
forcibly overthrow the ELECTED government was a GOOD thing because it wasn't
the RIGHT KIND of government. And the PEOPLE rising up (CONTRAS) and
fighting to take back THEIR country is BAD - it's EVIL because there can be
ONLY ONE WAY! MY WAY... SOCIALISMO O MUERTE!
The Sandanistas overthrew Samoza, a dictator. They held elections
afterwards and won twice as far as I remember, and ceded power in a
following election that they lost.

- Don Klipstein (***@misty.com)
krp
2006-02-27 22:55:35 UTC
Permalink
Sorry guy my OLE does really STRANGE things at times and I LOST the post.
krp
2006-02-27 22:58:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Klipstein
Post by krp
You see the
USSR dumping tons of land mines, AK-47's, RPG's into the hands of the
Sandinistas was a NOBLE AND HUMANITARIAN thing to do. Allowing THEM to
forcibly overthrow the ELECTED government was a GOOD thing because it wasn't
the RIGHT KIND of government. And the PEOPLE rising up (CONTRAS) and
fighting to take back THEIR country is BAD - it's EVIL because there can be
ONLY ONE WAY! MY WAY... SOCIALISMO O MUERTE!
The Sandanistas overthrew Samoza, a dictator. They held elections
afterwards and won twice as far as I remember, and ceded power in a
following election that they lost.
Latin America has only known TWO extremely BRIEF periods of a real
democracy. The first was in Cuba under Jose Marti. The Second was with Simon
Bolivar. Other than those two exceptions Latin America has swung from
dictator to dictator. The elections of the Sandinistas were hardly open,
they won the first and LOST the second. NEITHER election would really pass
muster as honest. Democracy in Latin America has been an ILLUSION. Promises
promises and no KY jelly as the people of Latin America take it up the ass
again and again no matter WHO is in office!
krp
2006-02-27 11:10:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of terrorist
attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong but
I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela. IT is
simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten the
people with. In one case the threat is real and the other its....
well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more recent
political meddling in various Central and South American countries are
considered as proof that the US is ready to continue that sort of activity
in the future. (remember the overthrow of Allende, the invasion of the
Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua,
the US backed overthrow of governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil,
Haiti, etc. etc.?)
We are speaking of airlines not the 19th century. Even then there was NO
invasion by the US of Venezuela, Yes I recally Allende's downfall. But I do
NOT remnmber the U.S. Marines landing in Chilie. Did I miss something?????
I don't think we "INCADED" the DOminican Republic either. Oh we gave aid to
the Contas in Nicuragua, why not? The USSR had armed the Sandanistas to the
teeth. Or in your warped world only ONE side allowed to be armed? Of course
the "RIGHT" side.... OF COURSE! Grenada? Yep the Marines landed, but then
AFTER the Cbans had done so so help as a proxy for the USSR to build a
bomber base. There is so much bullshit in the things you say all compacted.
Haiti's govenment fell because the Prist who ran it was/IS a fruitcake! Bay
of Pigs - in case you missed it - they were Cubans - all the U.S. did was
to provide transportation.
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the past
actions of the US government.
Oh horse shit. Most Venezuelans are too smart to fall for that shit! It
is HYPE ala Castro hyping the big bad BOOGEYMAN that plays in the poor
sections of town to folks who never spent a day in school! Chavez has home
grown problems to contend with. A sizeable chunk of his army that is against
him. A big chunk of the country that refuses to deal with him, and many of
his own ELITE "body guards" defecting. And for the first time in Venezuela's
history a significant OUT-migration especially of the most educated. Hugo
Chavez is making Venezuela another Cuba.............


I thought the touch of making it a CRIME to speak ill of him and his
government was a nice one. Nothing like the clenched fist of a DICTATOR to
impress folks! EL PRESIDENTE POR LA VIDA! SIEG HEIL! That goose stepping
impresses you does it? Maybe festooning the chest with dozens of medals
that were NEVER earned is something that impresses you? <groan>
John
2006-02-27 23:00:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Post by James Robinson
Post by krp
Hugo has learned well from his "daddy" Fidel.. Create one crisis
after another with the big BOOGEYMAN the U.S. ...
George does the same thing to keep the population afraid of terrorist
attacks. It's worked so far to keep them Democrats out of office.
Small problem - there HAVE been terrorist attacks. I may be wrong but
I don't believe the United States has ever invaded Venezuela. IT is
simply tired old propaganda to invent a boogeyman to frighten the
people with. In one case the threat is real and the other its....
well -- - it's BULLSHIT!!
Got it?
The US activies at the time of the United Fruit Company and more recent
political meddling in various Central and South American countries are
considered as proof that the US is ready to continue that sort of activity
in the future. (remember the overthrow of Allende, the invasion of the
Dominican Republic, Iran/Contra, Bay of Pigs, Noriega, Grenada, Nicaragua,
the US backed overthrow of governments in Guatemala, Ecuador, Brazil,
Haiti, etc. etc.?)
We are speaking of airlines not the 19th century. Even then there was NO
invasion by the US of Venezuela, Yes I recally Allende's downfall. But I do
NOT remnmber the U.S. Marines landing in Chilie. Did I miss something?????
I don't think we "INCADED" the DOminican Republic either. Oh we gave aid to
the Contas in Nicuragua, why not? The USSR had armed the Sandanistas to the
teeth. Or in your warped world only ONE side allowed to be armed? Of course
the "RIGHT" side.... OF COURSE! Grenada? Yep the Marines landed, but then
AFTER the Cbans had done so so help as a proxy for the USSR to build a
bomber base. There is so much bullshit in the things you say all compacted.
Haiti's govenment fell because the Prist who ran it was/IS a fruitcake! Bay
of Pigs - in case you missed it - they were Cubans - all the U.S. did was
to provide transportation.
Post by James Robinson
To Venezuelans it is not an idle threat, but reality, based on the past
actions of the US government.
Oh horse shit. Most Venezuelans are too smart to fall for that shit! It
is HYPE ala Castro hyping the big bad BOOGEYMAN that plays in the poor
sections of town to folks who never spent a day in school! Chavez has home
grown problems to contend with. A sizeable chunk of his army that is against
him. A big chunk of the country that refuses to deal with him, and many of
his own ELITE "body guards" defecting. And for the first time in Venezuela's
history a significant OUT-migration especially of the most educated. Hugo
Chavez is making Venezuela another Cuba.............
I thought the touch of making it a CRIME to speak ill of him and his
government was a nice one. Nothing like the clenched fist of a DICTATOR to
impress folks! EL PRESIDENTE POR LA VIDA! SIEG HEIL! That goose stepping
impresses you does it? Maybe festooning the chest with dozens of medals
that were NEVER earned is something that impresses you? <groan>
krp:

can you check your keyboard?

It seems to randomly leap to upper case like THIS?

Can you correct it?
a***@yahoo.com
2006-02-27 07:24:03 UTC
Permalink
Workswell in the us. Never catch the boogey man. Never.

Bin Laden knows this well.
krp
2006-02-27 11:20:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by a***@yahoo.com
Workswell in the us. Never catch the boogey man. Never.
Bin Laden knows this well.
Tell me something - do you think Bin Laden is having fun?????? Do you think
he's getting a great nights sleep? How would you feel if shit kept blowing
up all around you? Your closest lieutenants either being arrested or killed
almost EVERY DAY DAY AFTER DAY... Do you think his head is in a good place
today?

Oh Bin Laden is getting punished worse than prison. 4 YEARS of living in
constant TERROR... EVERY SECOND OF EVERY DAY...

Payback is a BITCH isn't it?

Try to get a mental image of Saddam Hussein being DRAGGED crying like a baby
from the little HOLE he was hiding in and pissing all over himself in
TERROR!


Did you know he pissed himself when they came to get him? Soaked himself
well and SHIT his pants!

The U.S. will catch Bin Laden when we want to. By then his mind will be
silly putty!

Oh and from what I hear (from undisclosed friends) he is a RAVING lunatic
his buddies have to keep sedated..... NOW!
freedom
2006-02-25 15:51:42 UTC
Permalink
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Post by krp
Post by air-news
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.
Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said late
Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States 10
years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has failed
to recognize improvements since then.
"We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical authority,"
the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce the
frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."
The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
television.
And I think that ALL air traffic of ALL kinds between the US and Venezuela
should be blocked!
Then how will you get there, to shop for your fourth wife?

http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com
mrtravel
2006-02-25 16:04:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by freedom
Then how will you get there, to shop for your fourth wife?
http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com
"Nomen", are you sad because you can't find one?
freedom
2006-02-25 17:17:55 UTC
Permalink
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Post by mrtravel
Post by freedom
Then how will you get there, to shop for your fourth wife?
http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com
"Nomen", are you sad because you can't find one?
What's "Nomen"? Where do you see that in my headers?

http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com
Borked Pseudo Mailed
2006-02-25 17:25:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by freedom
Then how will you get there, to shop for your fourth wife?
http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com
"No[SLAP!]
Found a job yet, psycho?

Not going down to Orange County to molest your daughter this weekend?

Your latest little "venture" in Seattle flopped again, didn't it?

Usenet Public Message

The "mrtravel" psycho:

- is a 47 year old unemployed loser, alcoholic, drug addict/dealer
- has been trolling usenet and flooding newsgroups for TWO DECADES
- has been harassing and stalking usenet posters for TWO DECADES
- is a known criminal, in trouble with the law since he was a teenager
- has no life outside usenet, is online trolling/harassing/stalking 24/7
- is such a loser he often responds to posts within one or two minutes
- is a known liar and bullshitter, lies about everything
- was fired by Cisco in early 2005 for doing all of the above from work
- likes to make death threats
- is a known pedophile and child sexual predator
- is a known importer of Russian whores looking for fast cheap green cards

If you are one of his victims, report him to Scotts Valley police:

Michael D. Voight, aka "mrtravel"
111 Bean Creek Rd, No. 118
Scotts Valley, CA 95066-4148
(831) 438-2485

Scotts Valley PD
One Civic Center Drive
Scotts Valley, CA 95066
(831) 440-5670

Police Chief Steve Lind
s l i n d @ s c o t t s v a l l e y . o r g

http://www.scottsvalleypd.com

Also contact the Scotts Valley mayor:

Paul Marigonda
m a r i g o n d @ p a c b e l l . n e t

About the "mrtravel" psycho - FAQ
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.travel.cruises/msg/f207022ace08c90c

More info on the psycho
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.travel.cruises/msg/25a7ed8ad9d9d920

mrtravel's drug abuse
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/ba.general/msg/f0c64751c93c3e2c

mrtravel's wife left him
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.travel.air/msg/6828ed1eb3843662
krp
2006-02-26 01:31:07 UTC
Permalink
DAVID MOORE
Post by freedom
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Post by krp
should be blocked!
Then how will you get there, to shop for your fourth wife?
http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com
You remain a "STALKER!"
PM
2006-02-25 15:27:15 UTC
Permalink
Cuban spy may link a Castro to shootdown
United Press International, Inc.
http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/view.php?StoryID=20060223-011031-4623r
MIAMI, Feb. 23 (UPI) -- A potential witness may exist to pursue an
indictment of Raul Castro, brother of Cuban leader Fidel Castro, in
shoot-downs of civilian planes, a report said.

A source told the Miami Herald on condition of anonymity that Gerardo
Hernandez -- currently in a federal prison on spying charges -- may
have information linking Raul Castro to the 1996 downings of Brothers
to the Rescue civilian planes in international waters.

Ten years ago, Cuban MiGs shot down two unarmed civilian airplanes
killing three U.S. citizens.

Hernandez faces life in prison on spying charges if his appeal fails.

His lawyer Paul McKenna, however, said that his client has no such
information and characterized assertions that he might as
"ridiculous."

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Distributed by
Chachi Novellas Bengochea
Delray Beach, Florida U.S.A.
Scanned by Norton Internet Security Professional.
Group: ForFreedom-Justice
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ForFreedom-Justice
"Live-Free-or-Die"
"One nation UNDER G-D" "IN G-D WE TRUST"
CUBAN SUGAR MARKET & THE US GOV.- Learn the true reasons that keep
Castro in power. The "hidden" power manipulating the US Government,
and the resultant corruption of its institutions. Watch the
documentary: COVERING CUBA 4: The Rats Below. Film exposes sugar
price control by ADM, owners of Wash. DC. A "must see" for every
American. Order your DVD copy at:
http://www.cubacollectibles.com/cuba.mv?p=108-CC4



"air-news" <air-***@news.air> a écrit dans le message de news:
***@news...
| By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
|
| Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
| from flying into this South American nation and is restricting
flights
| by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
| nation's federal aviation agency said.
|
| Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said
late
| Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
| ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States
10
| years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has
failed
| to recognize improvements since then.
|
| "We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical
authority,"
| the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce
the
| frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."
|
| The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
| television.
|
| In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the
decision
| was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
| United States and Venezuela. He said the U.S. urged Venezuela to
| respect the agreement.
|
| Relations between Caracas and Washington have been tense recently,
| with U.S. officials criticizing Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez,
who
| has threatened to cut off oil exports to the U.S.
|
| Roberto Pulido, president of the Venezuelan Association of Airlines,
| said the three U.S. carriers were told of the ban on Thursday and
were
| meeting Friday with Venezuelan aviation officials.
|
| "The closing or restriction of operations by these airlines will ...
| dramatically affect tourism and business," the association said in a
| statement.
|
| Atlanta-based Delta Air Lines operates a daily route from Atlanta to
| Venezuela. Continental Airlines has a daily round trip to Caracas
from
| Houston and a weekly round trip to Caracas from Newark, N.J.
|
| "We are very disappointed by this unilateral action by the
Venezuelan
| government," said Gina Laughlin, a spokeswoman for Delta.
|
| Continental is negotiating with Venezuelan authorities "to try to
| resolve the situation immediately and amicably," the carrier said
| Friday.
|
| "The outcome, however, is not within Continental's control," it
said.
|
| American Airlines operates up to seven flights a day to Venezuela,
| mostly from Miami but also from Dallas-Fort Worth, New York and San
| Juan, Puerto Rico. Venezuela is threatening to eliminate all but
three
| daily flights between Miami and Caracas, American officials said.
|
| American Airlines spokesman Dan Elwell said the airline was
surprised
| by the announcement.
|
| "American Airlines had no warning of this announcement at all,"
Elwell
| said.
|
| FedEx Corp. spokeswoman Sandra Munoz said the shipping company has
| five flights a week to Venezuela and may also be affected by the
ban.
|
| The FAA restricted Venezuelan flights to the U.S. in 1996 because it
| said the country didn't meet international safety standards.
|
| Venezuelan officials say they have improved standards since then.
|
| AMR shares fell 64 cents, or 2.5 percent, to close at $25.23 on the
| New York Stock Exchange, while Continental shares lost 7 cents to
| close at $23.24. Delta is operating under bankruptcy court
protection.
PM
2006-02-25 15:28:12 UTC
Permalink
Hillary Clinton no recordó el asesinato de los 4 miembros de Hermanos
al Rescate.
por Rafael M. Estévez
La senadora por New York, Hillary Clinton, finalizó ayer sábado
una muy activa semana política en el Sur de la Florida fustigando a la
actual Administración en la Casa Blanca con una serie alegatos que no
vamos a entrar a discutir ni a servirle de caja de resonancia.

En realidad la ambiciosa ex Primera Dama de 59 años, sólo vino a
buscar dinero para su campaña electoral y pronunció sus acostumbrados
discursitos ante la Cámara de Comercio de Miami Beach y en otros
foros. Hay que recordar que la noche anterior celebró una cena de
recaudación de fondos entre tantos seguidores de su falacio e infiel
esposo.

No hizo la mínima alusión de la visita del popular Senador
republicano John McCain y del ex Senador demócrata John Edwards, los
dos nombres que suenan como presidenciables para el 2008. ¿Qué raro
verdad?

Pero, hasta el momento de escribir lo que están leyendo, tampoco
hizo referencia que ayer que se cumplían 10 años del asesinato de las
cuatro personas que volaban en dos avionetas de los Hermanos al
Rescate que fueron pulverizadas por dos cohetes, creo que eran rusos,
en aguas internacionales, desarmadas, sin ninguna provocación y por el
sólo delito que estaban en busca de personas que huían en rústicas
embarcaciones del gobierno totalitario cubano.

Su esposo nunca hizo nada por detener a los dos Migs cubanos que
estaban siendo vigilados desde un centro de control de vuelos y que
alertaron de la salida de ambas naves militares cubanas. Es por eso
existe la penosa grabación de los dos hermanos pilotos asesinos que
reían y se vanagloriaban de haberlos derribado con la torre de mando
de Cuba y tampoco hizo nada por castigar a los responsables de este
brutal asesinato que todavía está impune.

A ella nada les importó. Mucho menos le ha importado ni le
importará lo que sufre el pueblo cubano. Si los residentes del Estado
de New York la vuelven a elegir como su Senadora ese será su problema
y si ella aspira a la Presidencia de los EE.UU, entonces será el
nuestro de tratar de evitarlo.

Jamás esta señora se ha pronunciado a favor de tantos presos
políticos y de tanta humillación que sufren las mujeres cubanas. La
clasifico igual o peor que la genuflexa al régimen cubano y Premio de
la Paz, Rigoberta Menchú.

No vale la pena seguir escribiendo sobre esta persona que carece de
los más elementales sentimientos humanos porque sólo tiene ambiciones
de poder. .-.-.
hob
2006-02-25 18:19:20 UTC
Permalink
Hey, if you want to piss somebody off, be sure its one of the major US oil
suppliers like Venezuela.
Post by air-news
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.
Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said late
Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States 10
years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has failed
to recognize improvements since then.
"We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical authority,"
the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce the
frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."
The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
television.
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela. He said the U.S. urged Venezuela to
respect the agreement.
Relations between Caracas and Washington have been tense recently,
with U.S. officials criticizing Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who
has threatened to cut off oil exports to the U.S.
Roberto Pulido, president of the Venezuelan Association of Airlines,
said the three U.S. carriers were told of the ban on Thursday and were
meeting Friday with Venezuelan aviation officials.
"The closing or restriction of operations by these airlines will ...
dramatically affect tourism and business," the association said in a
statement.
Atlanta-based Delta Air Lines operates a daily route from Atlanta to
Venezuela. Continental Airlines has a daily round trip to Caracas from
Houston and a weekly round trip to Caracas from Newark, N.J.
"We are very disappointed by this unilateral action by the Venezuelan
government," said Gina Laughlin, a spokeswoman for Delta.
Continental is negotiating with Venezuelan authorities "to try to
resolve the situation immediately and amicably," the carrier said
Friday.
"The outcome, however, is not within Continental's control," it said.
American Airlines operates up to seven flights a day to Venezuela,
mostly from Miami but also from Dallas-Fort Worth, New York and San
Juan, Puerto Rico. Venezuela is threatening to eliminate all but three
daily flights between Miami and Caracas, American officials said.
American Airlines spokesman Dan Elwell said the airline was surprised
by the announcement.
"American Airlines had no warning of this announcement at all," Elwell
said.
FedEx Corp. spokeswoman Sandra Munoz said the shipping company has
five flights a week to Venezuela and may also be affected by the ban.
The FAA restricted Venezuelan flights to the U.S. in 1996 because it
said the country didn't meet international safety standards.
Venezuelan officials say they have improved standards since then.
AMR shares fell 64 cents, or 2.5 percent, to close at $25.23 on the
New York Stock Exchange, while Continental shares lost 7 cents to
close at $23.24. Delta is operating under bankruptcy court protection.
E***@gmail.com
2006-03-03 20:57:22 UTC
Permalink
Pa'que se jodan todos los malditos gusanos.

Nada hay que hacer viajando para el Imperio, mejor vayan a pasear para
Cuba
Post by air-news
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer
Venezuela plans to prohibit Continental Airlines and Delta Air Lines
from flying into this South American nation and is restricting flights
by a third major U.S. carrier, American Airlines, the head of the
nation's federal aviation agency said.
Francisco Paz, president of the National Aviation Institute, said late
Thursday the action was taken because the U.S. had placed a similar
ban on some Venezuelan carriers serving routes to the United States 10
years ago due to safety violations. Venezuela said the U.S. has failed
to recognize improvements since then.
"We have exhausted all avenues with the U.S. aeronautical authority,"
the institute said in a statement. "We have been forced to reduce the
frequency of flights of U.S. airline companies from the U.S."
The ban will take effect on March 1, Paz told local Globovision
television.
In Washington, State Department spokesman Adam Ereli said the decision
was unjustified and violated a 1953 aviation agreement between the
United States and Venezuela. He said the U.S. urged Venezuela to
respect the agreement.
Relations between Caracas and Washington have been tense recently,
with U.S. officials criticizing Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, who
has threatened to cut off oil exports to the U.S.
Roberto Pulido, president of the Venezuelan Association of Airlines,
said the three U.S. carriers were told of the ban on Thursday and were
meeting Friday with Venezuelan aviation officials.
"The closing or restriction of operations by these airlines will ...
dramatically affect tourism and business," the association said in a
statement.
Atlanta-based Delta Air Lines operates a daily route from Atlanta to
Venezuela. Continental Airlines has a daily round trip to Caracas from
Houston and a weekly round trip to Caracas from Newark, N.J.
"We are very disappointed by this unilateral action by the Venezuelan
government," said Gina Laughlin, a spokeswoman for Delta.
Continental is negotiating with Venezuelan authorities "to try to
resolve the situation immediately and amicably," the carrier said
Friday.
"The outcome, however, is not within Continental's control," it said.
American Airlines operates up to seven flights a day to Venezuela,
mostly from Miami but also from Dallas-Fort Worth, New York and San
Juan, Puerto Rico. Venezuela is threatening to eliminate all but three
daily flights between Miami and Caracas, American officials said.
American Airlines spokesman Dan Elwell said the airline was surprised
by the announcement.
"American Airlines had no warning of this announcement at all," Elwell
said.
FedEx Corp. spokeswoman Sandra Munoz said the shipping company has
five flights a week to Venezuela and may also be affected by the ban.
The FAA restricted Venezuelan flights to the U.S. in 1996 because it
said the country didn't meet international safety standards.
Venezuelan officials say they have improved standards since then.
AMR shares fell 64 cents, or 2.5 percent, to close at $25.23 on the
New York Stock Exchange, while Continental shares lost 7 cents to
close at $23.24. Delta is operating under bankruptcy court protection.
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...